Intrepid Murmurings

It's February in Seattle, and the winter dreariness is upon us.  Though I like the idea of getting the kids outside in nature in all sorts of weather in theory, personally, that is a really hard thing for me to do.  I know that once we do it more often, we'll sort out the right kind of gear we need (rain pants, anyone?) and get more used to braving the elements, and I KNOW we would all feel better if we did it...  

But.  It's cold!  And WET!  And grey.  And I'm lazy....  Bleh!

So, here are a few things we like to do -- indoors -- this time of year.  I know we are blessed to be living in a very kid-friendly city, with a lot of good options.  I also know that with multiples -- especially newly mobile toddlers  --- any outing is a huge undertaking and sometimes a leap of faith.  It's worth it, though, and does get easier with practice!  I forget when we started going to some of these places, age-wise, though I know it was rare I made it out much before Elsie and Delia were about 9 months or so. 

 Free is a very good price: 

• Library storytime.  Or, more often, just visiting the children's section of the local library, which has puzzles and stuffed animals, as well as plenty of books to read and check out.  
• Also, bookstore storytime, and just going there (for us, the local B&N) anytime to read books and play with their train set and other toys in the children's section.
• Visiting local toystores. This is AWESOME for us right now -- so much to play with, totally free, and we are often the only ones around on
  weekday AMs! This might be too challenging with multiple young toddlers until they will reliably listen to you about pulling tons of things off the shelves (for us, around 2 years old or so).  So far my kids don't whine about buying stuff, because it's just not on their radar that it's an option!
• Our REI has a fun kids climbing structure -- perhaps because it's the flagship store? In any case, it's free and awesome, and right next to a good lunch place for us, which is an ideal combo.
• The mall -- I am not generally a mall person, but during the day when its not crowded its a good outing. Play area, food court, riding the elevators, etc. I still take a stroller but at this age I can let them out to run for a bit sometimes, too.
• IKEA! -- Stroller for a lot of it, mini carts if you are feeling brave!  I let them out of the stroller in the kids section to play, and then do lunch in the cafe. Once they are potty trained we will definitely be trying out the kids area with free childcare (if they like it, I may bring my laptop and hang out in the cafe, ha ha)!   

• Open gym drop-in sessions at local kid's gyms (during the day when school is in session its almost all toddlers/preschoolers & less crazy. For southend Seattlites, the Jungle Gym is our closest and favorite, though I've also heard good things about Seattle Gymnastics Academy and I know there are others, too!
• Toddler gyms at community centers -- these are hugely popular around here, and soooooo great. Basically a gym full of toddler toys, balls, bikes, and sometimes bouncy houses, for a few bucks a kid  Totally contained. This was the first play-type outing I started doing when I had three kids under 4, and it was a great way to gain some confidence (for me) and burn off energy (for them. And me!). 
• Bouncy house places -- this sounds nuts but my girls loved them from before they learned to walk!   These are big warehouses filled with bouncy houses to enjoy.  There are several of them I haven't tried around here, but the one we love up north has specific baby/toddler inflatables that not crowded at all (neither are the rest of them on weekdays,  and grownups can play them too!).  
• Play cafes (coffeeshops with kid toys/play areas). These range in greatness, from so-so to amazing.  Some are free, some are donation-based, some cost to play (but sometimes that buys you a nicer space).  Great place to meet up with other parents if you don't feel like hosting a playdate.  

Museums and Tourist Attractions

• The zoo or aquarium -- our zoo has an indoor playground with an infant/toddler section as well so thats good even during bad weather. I've just recently heard our aquarium has toddler play days with special activities geared for younger kids, so we might check that out next... 
• Children's museums -- costs money like the zoo, but great for rainy days and a membership is totally worth it.  The Seattle Children's Museum has a contained baby area that was key for awhile there.  I know of four others within driving distance of Seattle, too (Olympia, Bainbridge Island, Everett, and Bellevue). 
• Seattle also has the Museum of Flight, which we haven't utilized all that much (my girls interest is so-so) but I know some families love! 
• Local tourist attractions -- recently I took my girls to the Space Needle, when we realized the museum we were intending to go to was insanely crowded.  We all had a great time -- and it was really empty on a weekday morning in winter!  

Try Public Transit (best @ 2 years plus, I think!)

• Take the bus.  This is definitely for the brave -- at least at first! -- or when you have a second adult with you when you are outnumbered by wee ones. I survived a too-long bus ride downtown by myself with all three girls about a year ago, but can't say I'd recommend it solo with that young of toddler twins! Shorter trips would be awesome, though, especially if there is a good destination location (the library, etc) and now, at ages 2.5 and 4.5, I think we could handle the 40 min trip downtown no problem....
• We've had great luck with riding light rail trains (some which you can take a stroller on easily).
• Around here, ferry rides are awesome, even in the rain!  Another adventure that I prefer to have two adults for, though I may try it solo soon. 
• Another Seattle special -- the monorail -- short and sweet, and very easy on and off.  

• Yeah, playgroups. I know this kind of thing is not everyone's cup of tea, but I really enjoy them!  I am part of three groups that do regular or occasional playgroups (twins club, AP group, and mainstream parenting group from when Emma was a baby) and those were and still are fun for and manageable for us, as there are lots of other parents around willing to help out, the homes are generally baby-proofed, and novelty of different toys totally engages my kids.  Check local parenting forums or email lists, and possibly online sites like Meetup.com to find others with interests or locations similar to yours...   

What have I missed? Where do you go when the weather gets dreary to burn off some steam?

Still working on catching up with posts from the holidays!  I wanted to share this fun outing we did with my mom a few days after Christmas.  It was a busy morning, but so much fun.  We started by checking out a huge model train & village @ the Seattle Center (which we had actually seen in the very early setting-up stages, more than a month before!).  The girls were mesmerized.

Then we rode the monorail downtown.  The girls LOVED it!  

Once downtown, we hopped on the holiday carousel.  Until somewhat recently, it's been hard to do carousels since I couldn't spot both little girls at the same time.  Now they are pros, though Emma was feeling a bit nervous since this one didn't have "seatbelts".  My cautious girl! 

Though I know this would be great to do in the days leading up to Christmas, we've enjoyed it twice now after the big rush (last year, just Emma & I went, taking the bus, skipping the monorail portion) and had a blast -- no lines, no stress, still lots of fun!  Most everything was still up downtown, decoration-wise, though some of the window displays in the big stores were gone.  Oh well.  

After the merry-go-round we walked a few blocks to check out the fancy gingerbread house display at a downtown hotel.  Cool, but hard for the kids to see without being held, and we were outnumbered 3-2.  We then hit the food court for some lunch before heading back to our car via another monorail ride.  This will definitely a tradition, we all had a blast!

Delia in her new PINK coat, Elsie in turquoise, Emma in purple 

After months and months of watching it progress as we drove by, a brand new park near us finally opened last week.  The equipment had been up for quite awhile, tempting us, but the paths, steps and grass were finally (mostly) done and the fences keeping us out taken down.  So on Friday after Elsie and Delia's dance class, we picked up Emma from school and headed over for a picnic.  It was chilly and practically empty, but still tons of fun!  

There is both a smaller toddler play structure (which all of my kids enjoyed), plus a larger, much more challenging climbing structure great for older kids.  Mine loved trying it all out, though, and it will surely be a park that grows with them as they get older!    

                      

Leave it to us to be the ones putting off our pumpkin patch visit until the rainy day before Halloween!  Ha!  It's been a busy month and we have just not had the time or energy to make the trip before today.  We tried a different farm this year,  the closest one we could find, and it was lots of fun.  Its a bigger operation than last year's -- which was a very cute, small family farm, with animals & tractors and barns to explore -- but this one was convenient and did the job for us, still had lots of pumpkins even this late, and (like true Seattlites), the rain and mud only added to our adventure!  Next up tomorrow morning: carving three pumpkins!  

              

Two weekends ago, we went camping at Rasar State Park, about a 2 hour drive north of Seattle.  What a great place!  We went with our multiples club, and I've got to say, the group campsites were amazing!  So spacious -- we had TONS of space to ourselves, both with the individual campsites and the huge shared common area.  The kids could wander really far pretty safely.  It was certainly not "roughing it" camping -- the loop around the common area was paved (perfect for bikes, next time?), all sites had running water and electricity plug ins, and the common area had a huge covered area with water, electricity, tables, grills and a really nice firepit!  The bathrooms were a ways off, but super clean, never crowded, and had pay showers.  And there was a playground right there!  Pretty perfect for us!

That said, it was not all roses and sunshine -- though I do think it went pretty well for a first try with 3 kids under 5.  Here's a slideshow of all of our pictures, as well as some of the highs and lows of the weekend:

Highs:

• Driving went well.  Even though we left late and got stuck in traffic heading out of town, the girls were great travelers and only a minimal bit of whining at the end.  Packing snacks, books, and toys helped a lot with this (and timing travel for nap time on Friday).    


• The group site, as mentioned above, was awesome.  


• The company was also great.  So fun to spend some time and get to know some other families with twins (many with 3 or more kids, woohoo!).  Its great to see and be around people who "get it" with regards to the joys and challenges of multiples and larger families.


• On Saturday we went for a walk/hike that meandered through wooded trails, a huge grassy field, a path with blackberry bushes for picking, and then a rocky beach for playing and snack.  The return hike was also fun, for awhile anyway, but eventually things got a little dicey (everyone was tired and hungry, we got a little lost, we only had one carrier which Elsie was happy to ride in, but Delia was both exhausted and fighting being held in arms as we tried to power our way back to the campground), but everyone recovered quickly with food, so that was good!  


• Meals were great.  Dinner Friday was beans and rice (a slacker bag mix) with cheese, tortillas tomatoes and lettuce, and spicy sausages for the grownups.  Dinner the second night was a potluck, we brought baked beans from a can!  Breakfasts and lunches were bagels/bread with cream cheese, PB&J, cereal, deli meat and lots of fruit & baby carrots.  Last breakfast was scrambled eggs, fancy fancy!   All really easy stuff, and everyone liked it.   


• So glad I packed TOYS!  Not a ton, but some select things to keep them entertained during down times.  Elsie and Delia played with the buckets and shovels in the gravel a LOT.  Emma enjoyed gluing googly eyes to rocks and sticks to make little families. Books, balls, a frisbee, animals, and a few a couple new-to-us bendy people that I had tucked away for a special occasion rounded it out.  


• I also made a camping scavenger hunt, which Emma had fun with (with lots of grownup help reading, obviously, though I did go in and draw little pictures for everything) but it was a bit much for most of the little ones in our group I think! Better geared for kids 5-8 year olds, I'm thinking?  


• Totally, totally recommend bringing a little plastic potty if you have potty-trainers or kids not used to peeing in nature.  Worked great for us!  Also things we appreciated having:  lots of ziplock bags, wipes, hand sanitizer, crocs and socks for the kiddies (as well as sturdier shoes for walks), fleece footed pajamas for sleeping, and a carrier (Ergo) for longer hikes with the little ones (I forgot one, so we only had one and wished we had two).  

 Lows:

• Packing.  OMG, packing sucked.  I really and truly feel like I was packing (and shopping) beforehand for about as long as we were actually camping.  I am sure this will get better now that we know what kind of camping gear we have, what we need, and where it all is, but still!  Packing was a big ordeal and not fun.  Having a master list would probably be a great idea...


• Sleeping.  The kiddies did not sleep well.  Emma was pretty good, but Elsie and Delia took way longer to go to sleep than usual (playing and talking for a hour or so, keeping Emma awake too), didn't nap much, if at all, woke off and on all night long and slept on me, nursing, for the rest of it.  Blah.  Part of this was due to a cold and horrible coughs that of course got WAY worse for those two nights we were there.  They were miserable at night, and I was too.   I hope (hope hope!) that this goes better next time, and assume with more experience with it they will. They are used to cribs, not cosleeping, and the combo of sleeping uncontained and within reach of mama makes for a really restless night for us all!  


• Emma definitely had some challenges the first 24 hours or so, adjusting to the change in environment.  This is normal for her -- she likes her own room, her own bed, her own stuff and routines and is very disoriented when she does not have them.  Which is is understandable, for sure, but it meant much unpleasantness at various points until she magically determined that camping was indeed fun, about halfway through the weekend.   

1. Enjoyed the last homegrown raspberries of the season
2. Hung cloth diapers on the line
3. Lost my temper and yelled at my kids
4. Went on a hike with two adults and 6 kids under 4!  
5. Lounged in actual lounge chair at swimming lessons, woohoo!
6. Dealt with two poopy diapers at the pool (at least they were not the swimmers, ha ha)
7. Enjoyed a cup of green tea in a new mug, and was not interrupted once
8. Mowed the lawn, for the first time in 5 years
9. Nursed upset toddler in middle of half-mowed lawn
10. Had to laugh at ridiculousness of twin-induced tantrum (one insulted by sister's pretending)

Sometime in the last year or so, a new library opened up near us. Really close -- I'd say a 5 minute drive!  I'd been meaning to go to the Greenbridge Library with my girls for awhile, but kept forgetting or feeling not up for it since I knew I would have to get a new library card there since its in a different system than our other one (I know, big roadblock, ha ha).  One free morning I finally made good on my plans and actually got us there, soon after the library opened.  

The  Greenbridge community in White Center was previously public housing that was taken down and totally redone as "mixed income community" featuring green building techniques.  There are various types of housing in this very walkable community as well as an elementary school, a community center, the library & a YMCA "learning center", a playground (which I JUST discovered online, and need to go check out!!!), a fabulous coffeshop, and tons more spaces for retail (which have been empty and I hope fill up, soon!).  

We parked close to the library and went there first.  Its a pretty tiny library, but has a cute well stocked children's section, a fair number of computers, and lots of new, interesting media (CDs and DVDs) that caught my eye.  The girls and I had fun choosing a bunch of books for checkout, and the library was not crowded so the librarians had plenty of time to help us (which is appreciated, when I am herding two toddlers who are starting to get bored...).  

We dropped off the books in the car and then wandered off to explore.  Next to the library and community center is a large, open pavillion that is great for letting the kiddies loose.  There were cement benches and walls to climb on, intersting things on the ground, fun structures overhead, and a really cool (and huge!) piece of public art to enjoy. 

When we (inevitably) started getting antsy and hungry, we headed over to check out the Dubsea Coffee Shop, which I had heard good things about.  What a great coffeehouse!  Yummy food, great art, and it even had toys!  We didn't check those out this time -- we got an italian soda and cookie to share, and enjoyed them the civilized way, sitting at a table with chairs.  I will totally be back, with kids and without -- this place was nice!!!  

After that we headed back to the car (slowly!) with Emma hijacking my camera to take a few photos of her own, including this nice grass shot. Thats my girl -- I've always loved the plant closeups, myself! 

Yesterday, we hit the Washington State Ferry system with Grandma E and Grandpa T in tow.  I've been meaning to do this with the kids for awhile (since the littles have been decent enough on the stairs) but have been a bit hesitant about the whole herding-two-toddlers-and-a-preschooler-on-the-ferry thing.  With three on three (adults to kids), this seemed like a perfect time for a test run!  

While the Vashon Ferry is literally minutes from our house, I don't think the ride would have been long enough for us to really get out and enjoy it (three carseats = not speedy entrance and exit to the vehicle).  The car is still critical to our getting anywhere in a timely fashion with all the kids and gear, too -- no walk ons for us, yet! Bainbridge was the obvious choice -- we could catch it downtown, have a nice length ride, with lots of fun stuff to do on the other side.   

We took the 8:45 and made it with a few minutes to spare -- whew!  No lines heading that direction on a weekday morning! Once on, we got to explore the very uncrowded ferry -- it was a BIG boat, with several levels and lots of decks and viewing areas close to or totally empty.  The rain had stopped, and while there as a bit of a wind, it wasn't too cold.  The girls had lots of fun.  So much to see: Boats! Birds! Water! 

Once on the Island, we headed straight for Waterfront Park.  Just a block or two off the main street through town, it has a great playground with lots of fun stuff  -- including a VERY tall slide, labeled for ages 5-12.  Ha ha!  Good luck keeping my two year olds off that!!!  Grandma & Grandpa headed off to get  some coffee and treats while the girls played.  

 Ice cream!!!!  Took us awhile to find it, as it was down an alley-like road off the main street through town, but luckily a friendly local helped us out.  Mora Iced Creamery was a fabulous splurge to top off the afternoon.  The girls shared a "one and a half scoop" of chocolate (they kindly offered to split it between three cones, woo hoo) and it still was a lot for them!  I had dulce de leche.  YUM!  Delia required a clothing change after that, ha ha! 

We headed back to the ferry with only minutes to spare before the 12:20, but made it and drove right on with no problems.  Whew!  The girls were getting tired and a bit opinionated -- definitely ready for their naps.  We were home by 1:30 or so, and somehow nobody fell asleep until they were in their beds, woo hoo!  

All in all, a very successful adventure!  I'm not sure how feasible it would be for me to do it by myself with the three of them, yet -- its hard keeping track of them all getting in and out of the car, up the long flight of steps (though I did see an elevator...) and on the deck of the ferry!   But maybe.  I really want to check out the Kidmu Children's Museum over there, and would love to take the girls to the Blodel Reserve sometime, too!  If I had a plan of attack for the ferry, it think it might work....

How lucky we are to have such a great park just minutes from our house.  I know I have posted photos from here before, and will again -- we have such fun every time we go! The last shot is the view from our lunch table -- how can you go wrong with that!  

Linking up with my Wordless Wednesday friends at A Lot of Loves and HoboMama, go there for more great photographs.   

Man do we love this place!  Its part of the Tukwila Community Center here in South Seattle.  So far all three times we've gone its been nearly or totally empty!  

This post is linked up with my other Wordless Wednesday compatriots at Hobo Mama and A Lot of Loves -- check out more over at their lovely blogs!

A few weeks back, I broke down and took Emma to the salon for a haircut.  Holy moly, that hair was getting LONG!  This was not her first cut, but it was the first time we did something other than trim the bangs, and only the second time ever going to the salon.  Part of me definitely was torn about cutting that long, curly-whispy hair -- it was especially impressive in pigtails! --  but it was getting really hard to brush out.  And boy, do I hate trimming bangs.  I do it, because I am cheap, but I don't always do it well.   So nice to sit back and let a professional have at it!  

Here's a before pic out on the sidewalk in front of the salon: 

This salon is nice, too, as its close to us and VERY kid themed, with funny chairs (Emma's chose the horsey one) and a TV that was showing something on PBS.  Emma opted to watch and was soooooo still for the cut.  She was all smiles, loved it the whole thing and wasn't nervous at all (unlike her first visit, about a year ago).   

Another HUUUUGE pro of this place for me was the oodles of toys for Elsie and Delia to play with during Emma's cut.  They barely brushed the surface of all the toys there with what they played with, and had a lot of fun. They did want to sit in one of the big chairs too.... 

At the end, Emma got a blow dry and the option of something fancy (braids, ponytails, etc) and "fairy dust".  She went for just the glitter (can't see it much in this pic, but its there). 

Conclusion:  Sooooo worth it!  In 20 minutes (and for twenty smackers) she got an awesome cut, Elsie and Delia were totally entertained, and I was actually able to relax.  We were the only folks in the salon, too!  Its too expensive to make a regular habit (especially if E & D eventually need haircuts, yeeps!) but for an occasional treat, this was awesome.  Hooray!  

Several months ago we signed up for a group tour to a local farm (Kelsey Creek Farm in Bellevue).  Its a great little farm -- mostly for educational & recreational purposes I think, and run by parks department.  Its only 25 minutes or so from our house!  We had our tour last week, and it was lots of fun! 

We signed up for a "Babies in the Barnyard" tour with some friends, where we got a guided tour and got to pet and feed some animals. We even got there early (!) so we could do some exploring beforehand -- there is a nice playground and a few trails to walk on.  

The tour was for kids 2 years old and up, and it was manageable but took a lot of work to keep Elsie and Delia in the right places and doing the right things! There were rules about staying together, where we could stand at certain times, about putting hands through the fences and gates that they didn't really get --  and containing and corralling the both of them definitely kept me busy!  

But it was fun and they did great.  We saw a pig eat a banana, fed grass to the cows, and were able to pet a goat, a baby chick and a bunny.  We also saw chickens, ducks, sheep and horses.  And then got to plant a pumpkin seed in their pumpkin patch at the end. 

After the tour, we had a picnic lunch.  It was a great outing for my little crew. The public can visit and wander through parts of the farm anytime, so we will be back to check in and say hi to the animals we met, for sure! 

Here's one more from the other day at the park.  This was really fun.  I think we have some future curve-ball throwers and rock-skippers on our hands.  I love that this park is only 5 minutes from our house!  

Every Friday, a parent group I am a part of meets up at a local park for a "ramble" -- a walk through the woods, with kids.  We try to avoid the playgrounds, if there are any, and dive right into the more open, natural spaces.  We walk for a bit, and stop a lot.  Kids play, explore, run and climb.   Parents often get to talk (though more on that, later).     

We are really enjoying these walks!  We are so lucky to have a ton of great nature-oriented parks super close to us.   This is the first time I have been venturing out with Elsie and Delia without the stroller on walks longer than car to door type things.  It takes some planning and effort, but its been working really well!  They are almost two, and can manage most terrain pretty well (though they still need help with steps!).  On paths and trails, they are pretty easy to keep track of,  and in a group, other parents can kind of help me out some.  

I have to say, though, I have occasional flashes of envy when I see many of the moms chit chatting it up while their kids frolic about.  Not just at these walks, but most kid activities and events.  So many have just one baby or toddler, or a toddler or preschooler and a baby in a carrier.  Ah, it just looks so easy!  In any kind of group setting (even in ones like this with great, conscientious and helpful moms), I feel like I am always ON, either containing, corralling, tending to or entertaining my three.  I feel like I am generally pretty laid back when it comes to child-tending, but even despite that its a lot of work!

While we wait for others to show up and start the walk, I am figuring out things to keep my toddlers from running into the parking lot.  We look at bugs, we walk walls, we do laps.  On the hikes, I often am trying to get one to hurry up, while the others run ahead (this is actually not so bad, though -- its easiest when we are moving sometimes).  When we stop to play, when others are just hanging around and having fun, I have to start corralling more actively.  I am helping one climb a hill or cliff, while trying to keep an eye on the other two how scatter in different directions or whine to do something else.  Then I am helping one pee in the woods, while hoping the others don't take off down the path and out of view.    

I feel like I am always trying to think and plan ways to get everyone to do what I'd like them to, without making it look or feel like that is what I am doing -- ha!

At the playground, oy vey, they are keeping me on the move now, literally sprinting from one section to another as Elsie and Delia climb and dangle from HIGH equipment made for much bigger kids (they have no fear, and are great at it all, mostly!).  Meanwhile, Emma tries something new and panics halfway, wanting to be rescued.  Often, I am calling out for one of them, whoever has wandered away and escaped my current view.  By necessity, I give my girls a LOT more freedom and space on the playground than some folks do -- yet I am still always moving, lifting and climbing, myself. 

Meanwhile, other parents lounge and talk.  My day for that will come, right?  Someday?

In many respects, I feel lucky that my girls are as easy to manage as they are.  My girls are generally not "bolters" (though they are trying it out occasionally!) --which I know strikes fear into the heart of every parent of multiples or closely spaced singletons.  They are really social and (at least currently) do great around other people -- making all of this so much easier.  On these more organized outings, I often have help from others who keep an eye out for my kids, help them onto the swings, brushing them off if they fall, spotting them on higher climbers and such.  And man do I appreciate it!  I am always grateful for the offer (or just jumping in) to help, even if I feel like I have things under control, from both friends and strangers.  Sometimes, we really are totally fine, but other times I could really use a hand!  

On Friday, we walked a LONG way, I'd guess more than a mile, through the woods, up and down some hills and stairs, did the playground, went down to the beach, and then back again.  Great fun!  But the walk from the beach back to the parking lot was ROUGH -- they were tired & distracted, and while at least not whiny, they were not very focused on moving forward.  We had a stressful bathroom stop where E & D thought it was funny to try and run away from me both into gross stalls and out the door, while Emma needed help on the toilet.  Nap was approaching, but we were still so far from the car!  Nobody was willing to hold my hand, either.  I ended up walking forward short stretches by myself, then would sit along the path while they eventually caught up to me.   Repeat, repeat, repeat, until we were close enough to the car that they would all walk along with me.    

When we finally made it to the car, and I got all three strapped in pretty quick and got in the car to leave.  Just then another mama -- who happened to be nursing her baby in the next car over -- called through her open window "I'm so impressed!".  Her toddler started repeating it over and over, waving and dancing too, which was really funny. This woman hadn't seen how my last 30 minutes had gone, but being recognized and complimented by a random stranger for doing something not exactly easy was nice, in that moment.

I left with a smile.  We will be back!

These big colorful chairs are part of a permanent art display outside of one of our local community centers where we go for toddler open gym.  Who can deny the fun of climbing, sitting, and playing in giant metal chairs?  Not I!